🇹🇷 Turkey unlikely to cut the complicated ties with Israel

Site is back up.

Be apart of something great, join today! We are still updating some fixes.

G   Turkish Defense Forum

Old School

Senior Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Jan 26, 2024
Messages
1,808
Reaction score
793
Points
1,000
Origin

Residence

Axis Group

Although the latest rift is more than rhetorical, Ankara is unlikely to sever ties completely—unless Israel blocks it from participating in Gaza's reconstruction.
Turkish-Israeli ties are complicated, particularly with respect to the Palestinian conflict, and the latest rift reflects these complexities. The relationship fully ruptured in 2010 when Ankara sponsored a maritime flotilla to break Israel's blockade of Hamas-ruled Gaza, resulting in a controversial military raid and international diplomatic crisis. Soon thereafter, Turkey began openly providing substantial diplomatic support and shelter to Hamas.

Relations did not fully reset until more than a decade later, when Israel and Turkey reinstated their ambassadors in December 2022. By then, Ankara's role in Israeli-Palestinian affairs had diminished significantly, and Turkish officials realized that they needed to keep diplomatic channels with Israel open in order to maintain influence on this crucial regional issue—hence their months of caution about rupturing ties again after the Gaza war broke out in October. They are especially keen on positioning Turkey as a player in any postwar Gaza scenarios.
Four new developments put an abrupt halt to Erdogan's charm offensive in recent weeks. First, the Biden administration recently balked at setting a timeframe for the White House visit due to disagreements over the summit's deliverables, including potential trade deals and an elevated public welcome for Erdogan in Washington. Second, Ankara previously believed that the Gaza conflict would be ending within months; it now seems to think the crisis is on the verge of becoming an open-ended conflict. Third, Ankara is worried that Netanyahu may stay on the scene longer than anticipated—even if he is voted outin early elections, Turkish leaders believe he may stage a comeback in subsequent snap elections. Fourth, Erdogan's Justice and Development Party (AKP) suffered resounding defeats in local elections on March 31.

The latter development is significant in general political terms because AKP candidates lost mayoral races in major cities such as Istanbul, Ankara, and Izmir, booting the party down to second place in the national polls for the first time in two decades. Even more worrisome for Erdogan—and for Turkey's relations with Israel—is the breakthrough of the far-right New Welfare Party (YRP), which has gained nearly 7 percent in national polls, wooed away many supporters on Erdogan's vulnerable right flank, and taken some key cities from the AKP. In addition to holding various misogynistic, anti-Semitic, and anti-LGBTQ positions, the YRP is virulently anti-Israel.

What Lies Ahead?

To prevent more voters from migrating to the YRP, Erdogan has been hardening Turkey's policy against Israel since early April, and he will likely feel little pressure to alter this course given the end of his short-lived diplomatic romance with Biden and the growing Turkish perception that Netanyahu is here to stay. In practical terms, this means Ankara will no longer feel the need to tailor its criticisms of the Gaza war; in fact, it may consider further actions beyond rhetoric. On May 1, soon after news broke that Erdogan's Washington visit had been scrubbed, Turkey announced that it would join South Africa's bid to take Israel to the International Criminal Court "for committing genocide."

In the meantime, the trade ban alone could affect Israel's economy. For instance, cement and other construction materials are key Turkish exports to Israel, so their price may increase now that Israel must seek alternative suppliers. The same goes for goods such as steel, iron, and motor vehicles, whose shipping costs will climb if they have to be procured from more-distant markets.

Yet one important dynamic remains unchanged and may limit retaliatory steps against Israel—namely, Erdogan's desire to play a role in Gaza "the day after." In line with Turkey's vision of being a regional power, Ankara is eager to participate in reconstructing the Strip, sorting out Palestinian politics, and mediating a long-term solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. This suggests that it will shy away from another full 2010-style rupture. Even the trade boycott may prove porous—news reports indicate that Turkey is still providing Israel with Azerbaijani oil, sent by pipeline from the Caspian Sea to the Mediterranean port of Ceyhan and from there to Israel. Yet a full rupture could unfold quickly if Israel vetoes a Turkish role in Gaza, or if Israeli-Saudi talks implode.
 
Ofcourse, because there are benefits to having ties with Israel. Israeli technology and money.

Same with Egypt. Egypt could stop supplying oil to Israel, and Israeli planes wouldn't even fly! :):)
 
Basically, Ergogan has been balancing his strategy against the YRP party, which is gradually gaining ground in Turkey now. Nothing is more important for Erdogan than staying in power.
 

Erdogan says Turkey might enter Israel to help Palestinians
ReutersAnkara
Published: 29 Jul 2024, 22: 15

1722321742246.png
Turkey's president Tayyip Erdogan speaks during a press conference with Greek Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis (not seen) at the Presidential Palace in Ankara, Turkey, 13 May, 2024.Reuters

President Tayyip Erdogan said on Sunday that Turkey might enter Israel as it had done in the past in Libya and Nagorno-Karabakh, though he did not spell out what sort of intervention he was suggesting.

Erdogan, who has been a fierce critic of Israel's offensive in Gaza, started discussing that war during a speech praising his country's defence industry.

"We must be very strong so that Israel can't do these ridiculous things to Palestine. Just like we entered Karabakh, just like we entered Libya, we might do similar to them," Erdogan told a meeting of his ruling AK Party in his hometown of Rize.

Turkey halts all trade with Israel, cites worsening Palestinian situation.

"There is no reason why we cannot do this ... We must be strong so that we can take these steps," Erdogan added in the televised address.

AK Party representatives did not respond to calls asking for more detail on Erdogan's comments. Israel did not immediately make any comment.

The president appeared to be referring to past actions by Turkey.

In 2020, Turkey sent military personnel to Libya in support of the United Nations-recognised Government of National Accord of Libya.

Libyan prime Minister Abdulhamid al-Dbeibah, who heads the Government of National Unity in Tripoli, is backed by Turkey.

Turkey has denied any direct role in Azerbaijan's military operations in Nagorno-Karabakh, but said last year it was using "all means", including military training and modernisation, to support its close ally.​
 

Erdogan says Turkey might enter Israel to help Palestinians
ReutersAnkara
Published: 29 Jul 2024, 22: 15

View attachment 7202
Turkey's president Tayyip Erdogan speaks during a press conference with Greek Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis (not seen) at the Presidential Palace in Ankara, Turkey, 13 May, 2024.Reuters

President Tayyip Erdogan said on Sunday that Turkey might enter Israel as it had done in the past in Libya and Nagorno-Karabakh, though he did not spell out what sort of intervention he was suggesting.

Erdogan, who has been a fierce critic of Israel's offensive in Gaza, started discussing that war during a speech praising his country's defence industry.

"We must be very strong so that Israel can't do these ridiculous things to Palestine. Just like we entered Karabakh, just like we entered Libya, we might do similar to them," Erdogan told a meeting of his ruling AK Party in his hometown of Rize.

Turkey halts all trade with Israel, cites worsening Palestinian situation.

"There is no reason why we cannot do this ... We must be strong so that we can take these steps," Erdogan added in the televised address.

AK Party representatives did not respond to calls asking for more detail on Erdogan's comments. Israel did not immediately make any comment.

The president appeared to be referring to past actions by Turkey.

In 2020, Turkey sent military personnel to Libya in support of the United Nations-recognised Government of National Accord of Libya.

Libyan prime Minister Abdulhamid al-Dbeibah, who heads the Government of National Unity in Tripoli, is backed by Turkey.

Turkey has denied any direct role in Azerbaijan's military operations in Nagorno-Karabakh, but said last year it was using "all means", including military training and modernisation, to support its close ally.​
Why would Turkey jeopardize her economic well being for the sake of Palestinians while 400 million Arabs are sitting on their butts watch a horror show unfold...Turkish leadership is not suicidal like the Iranian leadership that have destroyed their economy for the sake of Palestians..they are pragmatic and keep the needs of their people as first priority.....Iranian mullas in other hand do not give damn about how opposed their people are to this subject and spend the hard earned $$$ on missiles and drones and fire them at Israel while their own people suffer ..meanwhile the Arabs get to enjoy life and watch next episode of the "Palestine meat grinder " in their tea houses..!!..WTF.
 
I heard Saudi Arabia was on the verge of recognizing Israel until the October 7th incident.

Saudi Arabia: no Israel ties without recognition of Palestinian state

By Reuters
February 7, 20245:16 AM ESTUpdated 6 months ago



U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken visits Saudi Arabia
U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken meets Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, February 5, 2024. Saudi Press Agency/Handout via REUTERS/File photo Purchase Licensing Rights, opens new tab
  • Summary
  • U.S. has led push for normalisation of Saudi-Israeli ties
  • U.S. Secretary of State Blinken visited Riyadh this week
RIYADH, Feb 7 (Reuters) - Saudi Arabia has told the United States it will not open diplomatic relations with Israel unless an independent Palestinian state is recognised on 1967 borders with East Jerusalem as its capital, its foreign ministry said on Wednesday.
Riyadh reiterated its call for permanent members of the U.N. Security Council that have not recognised a Palestinian state on the 1967 borders with East Jerusalem as its capital to do so, a ministry statement said.
Advertisement · Scroll to continue
Report this ad
It was referring to a state the Palestinians have long sought to establish alongside Israel in territories Israel occupied in a 1967 war: the West Bank including East Jerusalem, and the Gaza Strip.
The statement added that "Israeli aggression" against the Gaza Strip must also stop and Israeli forces must withdraw from the territory.
The United States had led months of diplomacy to get Saudi Arabia to normalise ties with Israel and recognise the country until the Gaza war began in October, leading Riyadh to shelve the matter in the face of Arab anger over Israel's offensive.
Advertisement · Scroll to continue
Report this ad
Reuters reported last week that Saudi Arabia would be willing to accept a political commitment from Israel to create a Palestinian state, rather than anything more binding, to try to get a defence pact with Washington approved before this year's U.S. presidential election.
U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken, who is touring the region, said Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman had "reiterated Saudi Arabia's strong interest in pursuing" normalisation when they met this week.
The video player is currently playing an ad. You can skip the ad in 5 sec with a mouse or keyboard

00:12Gaza farmer aims to revive agriculture in food scarce enclave





"But he also made clear what he had said to me before, which is that in order to do that two things are required: an end to the conflict in Gaza and a clear, credible, time-bound path to the establishment of a Palestinian state," Blinken said.
On Tuesday, White House National Security spokesperson John Kirby said that the Biden administration has received positive feedback that Saudi Arabia and Israel are willing to continue to have normalisation discussions.

MINISTRY STATEMENT

The Saudi foreign ministry statement said the "Kingdom has communicated its firm position to the U.S. administration that there will be no diplomatic relations with Israel unless an independent Palestinian state is recognized on the 1967 borders with East Jerusalem as its capital".
It reiterated "its call to the permanent members of the U.N. Security Council that have not yet recognized the Palestinian state, to expedite the recognition of the Palestinian state on the 1967 borders, with East Jerusalem as its capital".

The Gaza war has put renewed focus on the idea of the two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, even though negotiations have been moribund for years.
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has said he will not compromise on full Israeli security west of the Jordan River and that this stands contrary to a Palestinian state.
Countries including the United States and Britain have reiterated their support for the two-state solution.
British Foreign Secretary David Cameron said last week there would be a time when Britain would look to recognise a Palestinian state, including at the United Nations.
Get the latest news and expert analysis about the state of the global economy with Reuters Econ World. Sign up here.
Reporting by Enas Alashray in Cairo and Humeyra Pamuk; Writing by Tom Perry; Editing by Stephen Coates and Timothy

Saudi Arabia says it will recognize Israel, only if there is a Palestinian state on pre-1967 borders and East Jerusalem as the capital of Palestine.

I think that's a fair compromise.
 
Last edited:
Why would Turkey jeopardize her economic well being for the sake of Palestinians while 400 million Arabs are sitting on their butts watch a horror show unfold...Turkish leadership is not suicidal like the Iranian leadership that have destroyed their economy for the sake of Palestians..they are pragmatic and keep the needs of their people as first priority.....Iranian mullas in other hand do not give damn about how opposed their people are to this subject and spend the hard earned $$$ on missiles and drones and fire them at Israel while their own people suffer ..meanwhile the Arabs get to enjoy life and watch next episode of the "Palestine meat grinder " in their tea houses..!!..WTF.


@LegionnairE Is this accurate description?
 
Why would Turkey jeopardize her economic well being for the sake of Palestinians while 400 million Arabs are sitting on their butts watch a horror show unfold...Turkish leadership is not suicidal like the Iranian leadership that have destroyed their economy for the sake of Palestians..they are pragmatic and keep the needs of their people as first priority.....Iranian mullas in other hand do not give damn about how opposed their people are to this subject and spend the hard earned $$$ on missiles and drones and fire them at Israel while their own people suffer ..meanwhile the Arabs get to enjoy life and watch next episode of the "Palestine meat grinder " in their tea houses..!!..WTF.
If you fail to evict Israel from the Middle East, they will swallow most of Arab lands with the help of the USA. You have to support Palestine to safeguard your own sovereignty from Israel and the USA.
 
If you fail to evict Israel from the Middle East, they will swallow most of Arab lands with the help of the USA. You have to support Palestine to safeguard your own sovereignty from Israel and the USA.
you said "they will swallow most of Arab lands".....
Protection of "Arab Lands" is not the responsibility of Turkey or Iran..God has given Arabs lots of money and 400 million people let them protect their own lands..
85 % of Iranian population is against Iran involvement with Arab Israel affair...Killing of Hamas leader in Tehran by in an inside job is a good indication of how Iran's 85% population demonstrate their opposition to the issue.
 
you said "they will swallow most of Arab lands".....
Protection of "Arab Lands" is not the responsibility of Turkey or Iran..God has given Arabs lots of money and 400 million people let them protect their own lands..
85 % of Iranian population is against Iran involvement with Arab Israel affair...Killing of Hamas leader in Tehran by in an inside job is a good indication of how Iran's 85% population demonstrate their opposition to the issue.
It is ironic that first president Raisi , his foreign minister and then Haniyeh fell inside Iran. These were by no mean accidents regardless what naive people believe. All three were instrumental to operation Al-Aqsa Flood last year. Still, people are not getting the real message that Iranian population at large are opposed to the Islamic Republic's policies.
Then, It was the Arabs who kicked out the Ottoman Turks from Palestine during the first World War by collaborating with the British and French. Turks didn't forget that betrayal. Why do they want the Turks to help them ? Arabs never apologized for their historic betrayal against the Ottoman Turks. It was the Arabs who opened the door to the western powers in the middle east by helping them defeat the Ottoman Turks. They can not eat the cake and still have it.
Because of this betrayal, Turkey was the first country in the world to recognize Israel even before Soviets ( second country to recognize) and the American did.
 
Arabs never apologized for their historic betrayal against the Ottoman Turks.

Although some truth to it, many Arabs saw the Turks as only caring for their own and as oppressors. If today Turks hate Arabs on their land, imagine an unjust Ottoman on theirs.
 
Although some truth to it, many Arabs saw the Turks as only caring for their own and as oppressors. If today Turks hate Arabs on their land, imagine an unjust Ottoman on theirs.
Those later Ottoman Sultans were not that good as their ancestors were who used to be better rulers and not Turk tribalists. Those earlier Sultans never tried to impose Turkish language on the Algerians and Tunisians like the French evils did.
 
Those later Ottoman Sultans were not that good as their ancestors were who used to be better rulers and not Turk tribalists. Those earlier Sultans never tried to impose Turkish language on the Algerians and Tunisians like the French evils did.
No doubt French committed many evils in Algeria.
 
you said "they will swallow most of Arab lands".....
Protection of "Arab Lands" is not the responsibility of Turkey or Iran..God has given Arabs lots of money and 400 million people let them protect their own lands..
85 % of Iranian population is against Iran involvement with Arab Israel affair...Killing of Hamas leader in Tehran by in an inside job is a good indication of how Iran's 85% population demonstrate their opposition to the issue.
You protect Arab lands to protect your own from Israel and the USA. Just imagine what a greater Israel can do to Iran and Turkey with the help of the USA. Don't let Israel grab Arab lands and oil reserves because if that happens it will surely harm Iran and Turkey in a big way.
 
You protect Arab lands to protect your own from Israel and the USA. Just imagine what a greater Israel can do to Iran and Turkey with the help of the USA. Don't let Israel grab Arab lands and oil reserves because if that happens it will surely harm Iran and Turkey in a big way.

Iran is doing the most against the Israeli Zionist regime even though it is weak and incompetent.
 
Basically, Ergogan has been balancing his strategy against the YRP party, which is gradually gaining ground in Turkey now. Nothing is more important for Erdogan than staying in power.
Correct, his belligerent statements are mostly in order to consolidate islamist elements in the system.

As for most important thing being staying in power. That goes for just about all regimes in history.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back