[🇵🇰] Will Pakistan ever function as a secular state?

[Old School]

Source: https://tribune.com.pk/article/42202/will-pakistan-ever-function-as-a-secular-state

In Pakistan and, in fact, most of the Islamic world, the very concept of secularism is completely misunderstood. Somehow the concept has been thoroughly confused and amalgamated with atheism. An overwhelming majority of politicians, and even intellectuals, often try to defend themselves when "accused" of being secular, particularly on mainstream online media and Urdu print media. To declare oneself as a secular is considered equivalent to being considered an atheist in the public imagination.
The entire atmosphere is riddled with severe misconceptions about secularism. Due to fear of being branded an "atheist" and anti-Islamic, the word secular, in both letter and spirit, is virtually absent from the discourse. Even those who understand that secularism is fundamentally different from atheism often raise the question: "what good is secularism?" and "all we need is the right interpretation of religion."
What these "reinterpretation" folks fail to understand is that there are often multiple interpretations of religious text and while at the individual level, one has the option to choose one over the other without infringing on anyone's freedom, laws have to be uniformly applied across the board. So if we want to base our laws on shariah, eventually we will have to privilege one interpretation over the other since law cannot be selectively applied.
Treating religion as a personal matter is extremely essential as its projection into the public sphere is what causes discrimination and also leads to varying patterns of State sanctioned benefits and costs. By treating religion as a personal affair, a society tries to at least reduce such possibilities and reduce chances that a religious minority feels excluded. Muslim followers are not monolithic (as they are divided into sects), therefore a secular State, by being neutral (at least theoretically), ensures neutrality on religious grounds.

 

[Malang]

Not for the next 100 years and I won’t be alive to debate after that.

Pakistan will not be secular state even though most of its leaders are secular at heart. The Pakistan Peoples Party, The MQM, The Parvez Musharraf era and the military rules were generally secular governments.

 

[Deleted due to Error (Muji Iqbal)]

Pakistan should be an Islamic country. Islam also says to tolerate religious minorities and protect them as well.

 

[Lulldapull]

I believe the real test of being secular is if you don't reference nor bring up religion in your daily public discourse. The western Europeans have mastered this art rather well. Total separation of church and state. Humreeki (save for the NE/ SW) large metro areas are still fairly Evangelical/ Zionist. Problem is the US has weaponized/ commercialized religion into an industry.

For our country, we never had real (elected) leadership to play the mentoring/ leadership role. Ayub Khan tried his best to cultivate our society along the western model, but he could only do so much. Jinnah sahb was totally secular. So was Bhutto for the most part. I believe our state has not really played the role of a committed stakeholder with a vision, invested in the future of our nation.

 

[Old School]

I believe the real test of being secular is if you don't reference nor bring up religion in your daily public discourse. The western Europeans have mastered this art rather well. Total separation of church and state. Humreeki (save for the NE/ SW) large metro areas are still fairly Evangelical/ Zionist. Problem is the US has weaponized/ commercialized religion into an industry.

For our country, we never had real (elected) leadership to play the mentoring/ leadership role. Ayub Khan tried his best to cultivate our society along the western model, but he could only do so much. Jinnah sahb was totally secular. So was Bhutto for the most part. I believe our state has not really played the role of a committed stakeholder with a vision, invested in the future of our nation.

Our country never had an Islamic revolution to become an Islamic Republic. When We gained independence from Britain under Jinnah, our country's name was the "Dominion of Pakistan." It became a pseudo-Islamic Republic with fake Sharia laws during the generals ' rule. No one ever voted in a referendum for the Islamic Republic, either. Therefore, this religious dogma only came from the army barracks, not the people. It is easy. Another general will have to remove this fake tag. The rest of the moulvis will run away when there is no money to milk. Londonistanis and few will be unhappy, but who cares! We need the separation of religion and state affairs; another general will do it.

 

[Deleted due to Error (Muji Iqbal)]

Our country never had an Islamic revolution to become an Islamic Republic. When We gained independence from Britain under Jinnah, our country's name was the "Dominion of Pakistan." It became a pseudo-Islamic Republic with fake Sharia laws during the generals ' rule. No one ever voted in a referendum for the Islamic Republic, either. Therefore, this religious dogma only came from the army barracks, not the people. It is easy. Another general will have to remove this fake tag. The rest of the moulvis will run away when there is no money to milk. Londonistanis and few will be unhappy, but who cares! We need the separation of religion and state affairs; another general will do it.

Come on mate, If Pakistan does not become an Islamic country, what was the point of partition.

Islamic laws also tolerate other religions and protect the rights of minorities.

If we implement Islamic laws like cutting of the hand and stoning to death for adultery, then crime would be a lot less.

 

[Lulldapull]

Our country never had an Islamic revolution to become an Islamic Republic. When We gained independence from Britain under Jinnah, our country's name was the "Dominion of Pakistan." It became a pseudo-Islamic Republic with fake Sharia laws during the generals ' rule. No one ever voted in a referendum for the Islamic Republic, either. Therefore, this religious dogma only came from the army barracks, not the people. It is easy. Another general will have to remove this fake tag. The rest of the moulvis will run away when there is no money to milk. Londonistanis and few will be unhappy, but who cares! We need the separation of religion and state affairs; another general will do it.

Bhai Iran k saath dekheen kya howa hae…..….shah Pehlvi sahb and Ayub khan, yahya khan and Bhutto sahb we’re all chaddi yaar…..he almost turned Iran into a first world country.

Instead what happened over in Iran is that the communists infiltrated and caused all these Muslim dramay.

Now Iran has turned into a jungli animal. Whole Irani society is liberal, but they have been turned into a mini USSR.

All we got is ghareeb mercenary on offer for the west. Irani Sawdi floating on massive energy and the west will never leave them alone. And believe me issy vaja say the impact on us as impressionable ghareeb Muslims is horrible!

This is what is going on in our region.

We seriously need a total political makeover in our country. We are just an innocent exploited country.

 

[Lulldapull]

I believe if the Shah stuck around another quarter century……most of the relevant Muslim world would’ve totally become secular and modern and progressive.

Mager nahi……hum itnay khush qismat nahi hain.

 

[Old School]

I believe if the Shah stuck around another quarter century……most of the relevant Muslim world would’ve totally become secular and modern and progressive.

Mager nahi……hum itnay khush qismat nahi hain.

Our government plays Islam just like any street beggar does- start reciting. They even don't believe what they say about religion. It is all about money. The more someone talks about religion, the darker side they have.

 

[Lulldapull]

Our government plays Islam just like any street beggar does- start reciting. They even don't believe what they say about religion. It is all about money. The more someone talks about religion, the darker side they have.

Lot of people now saying that we are not going to make it if things continue on like this. Our situation is getting more n more difficult and there is just no leadership for a long time. PML/ PTI or PPP are not going to cut it. Army is after saving its own neck in these circumstances. They are the only thing standing or we disintegrate in the blink of an eye.

Our bewquff awaam thinks mazhab will save us…..