[🇵🇰] Will Pakistan ever function as a secular state?

[Mustafa.Iq]

You have a right to it, but don't force it upon others or change Jinnahs speeches for you agenda

When did I change Jinnah's speeches? Where are you regurgitating garbage from?

I appreciate Jinnah's contributions to the Muslim League. But he is not my source for legislation.

 

[Old School]

We may have to provide little torture to wahabi preachers here which we did not allow before. Something Wahabi Madrassa boys get from their teachers. Pro- wahabi people are not going have honeymoon here anymore. I may have to bring in @ThunderCat to do it.

 

[Mustafa.Iq]

We may have to provide little torture to wahabi preachers here which we did not allow before. Something Wahabi Madrassa boys get from their teachers. Pro- wahabi people are not going have honeymoon here anymore. I may have to bring in @ThunderCat to do it.

Those who you call "Wahabis" are called really "Salafis."

 

[MuHayMin]

When did I change Jinnah's speeches? Where are you regurgitating garbage from?

You just said Jinnah created an Islamic state and when I pointed out drank whiskey which he most likely did because he was very inspired by liberalism if you know anything about it. You said you just follow Islam and Quran or whatever your twisted understanding of Islam is. Because that's definitely not Islam. So you are pushing for an agenda using Jinnah

 

[Mustafa.Iq]

You just said Jinnah created an Islamic state and when I pointed out drank whiskey which he most likely did because he was very inspired by liberalism if you know anything about it. You said you just follow Islam and Quran or whatever your twisted understanding of Islam is. Because that's definitely not Islam. So you are pushing for an agenda using Jinnah

That is YOUR CLAIM. Do you have proof Jinnah alcohol? And even if he did that makes him a sinner, not an apostate.
Yes, my father said although appreciates Jinnah, Jinnah was not very strict about Islam.

And Jinnah is irrelevant. He is not my source for legislation. I appreciate what he did for the All India Muslim League. But other than that,

Pakistan ka matlab kya "La illaha illala Muhummadur Rasoolulaah."

And what is your twisted understanding of Islam? Follow some of Islam and don't follow other parts of it?

 

[MuHayMin]

That is YOUR CLAIM. Do you have proof Jinnah alcohol? And even if he did that makes him a sinner, not an apostate.

And Jinnah is irrelevant. He is not my source for legislation. I appreciate what he did for the All India Muslim League. But other than that,

Pakistan ka matlab kya "La illaha illala Muhummadur Rasoolulaah."

And what is your twisted understanding of Islam? Follow some of Islam and don't follow other parts of it?

Jinnahs the guy that removed the word "god" from a speech so it wouldn't get hijacked by people like you. Say whatever you want, are you saying La Ilaha has been reduced to a nation of 1nbreds? Don't disrespect God or Islam like that.

There are many Muslims who drank alcohol and have contributed more for Islam than you have that's for sure your no judge.

 

[Mustafa.Iq]

Jinnahs the guy that removed the word "god" from a speech so it wouldn't get hijacked by people like you. Say whatever you want, are you saying La Ilaha has been reduced to a nation of 1nbreds? Don't disrespect God or Islam like that.

Not sure who brainwashed you with your liberal nonsense.

Then what was the point of partition? If Pakistan is supposed to be a half-baked copycat of a western liberal country, then partition was wrong.

Point of partition was the safeguard the rights of Muslims of South Asia and so they could live according to Islamic laws and injunctions.

Not your half baked liberal trash which most Pakistanis would not accept.

And of course you say what you want as well.

Disrespecting Allah or Islam? How am I doing that. Now I am starting to think you have a small sized brain.

What Pakistan needs is a Meiji Restoration, where there is an emphasis on education and economy. We are already good enough on the military sector.

 

[MuHayMin]

Not sure who brainwashed you with your liberal nonsense.

Then what was the point of partition? If Pakistan is supposed to be a half-baked copycat of a western liberal country, then partition was wrong.

Point of partition was the safeguard the rights of Muslims of South Asia and so they could live according to Islamic laws an injunctions.

Not your half baked liberal trash which most Pakistanis would not accept.

And of course you say what you want as well.

Disrespecting Allah or Islam? How am I doing that. Now I am starting to think you have a small sized brain.

The point of partition was safety for the Muslims and the minorities who were going to suffer hindu raj or hindu rule which they are today you fool. They would have been seen outside the caste system on dalit tier.
Also I'm no liberal

 

[Mustafa.Iq]

The point of partition was safety for the Muslims and the minorities who were going to suffer hindu raj or hindu rule which they are today you fool. They would have been seen outside the caste system on dalit tier.
Also I'm no liberal

Go read a accredited history book. Pakistan movement was not about other minorities (Christians, Buddhists, Parsis, Sikhs, etc.).
Pakistan Movement was about Muslims.

But of course, minorities would have their rights according to justice and moral principles in the newly created Pakistan.

 

[MuHayMin]

Go read a accredited history book. Pakistan movement was not about other minorities.
Pakistan Movement was about Muslims.

Jinnah the lover of liberalism, the creator of the Dominion of Pakistan, was out there pushing for sharia law according to you

 

[MuHayMin]

Go read a accredited history book. Pakistan movement was not about other minorities (Christians, Buddhists, Parsis, Sikhs, etc.).
Pakistan Movement was about Muslims.

But of course, minorities would have their rights according to justice and moral principles in the newly created Pakistan.

Go read a accredited history book. Pakistan movement was not about other minorities.
Pakistan Movement was about Muslims.

But of course, minorities would have their

You must be reading books written by indians

 

[Mustafa.Iq]

Jinnah the lover of liberalism, the creator of the Dominion of Pakistan, was out there pushing for sharia law according to you

Don't know where you are getting your crap from.
Yes Jinnah was influenced by British political Liberalism.

But Jinnah does not mention anywhere the word "liberalism" or "secularism" in his speeches. nice try though.

but Jinnah mentions Islamic Socialism and Islamic Democracy.

 

[Mustafa.Iq]

You must be reading books written by indians

And why would Pakistan movement care about Buddhists, Christians, Sikhs, Parsis?

Sorry mate, I read Pakistani accredited books and Western books by Stanley Wolpert and Hector Bolitho. Also by William S. Metz.

 

[MuHayMin]

Don't know where you are getting your crap from.
Yes Jinnah was influenced by British political Liberalism.

But Jinnah does not mention anywhere the word "liberalism" or "secularism" in his speeches. nice try though.

but Jinnah mentions Islamic Socialism and Islamic Democracy.

“…we will be the democratic type, embodying the essential principles of Islam. Today, they are as applicable in actual life as they were 1300 years ago. Islam and its idealism have taught us democracy. It has taught equality of man, justice and fair play to everybody. We are inheritors of these glorious traditions and are fully alive to our responsibilities and obligations as framers of the future constitution of Pakistan. In any case Pakistan is not going to be theocratic state — to be ruled by priests with a divine mission. We have many non-Muslims — Hindus, Christians and Parsis — but they are all Pakistanis. They will enjoy the same rights and privileges as any other citizens and will play their rightful part in the affairs of Pakistan.”

— Jinnah’s address to the people of the United States (21 February 1948)

 

[Mustafa.Iq]

You must be reading books written by indians

I have read this one too, this book debunks the secular Jinnah myth spread by Indians and some Western scholars to weaken Pakistan's identity.

If Jinnah was so secular and liberal, why join the Muslim league and fight for the Muslim's case. Saleena Karim Baji pretty debunks the Secular Jinnah Myth.